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Subject: Re: DB doesn't exist

Author: Robert Hyatt

Date: 21:19:56 01/14/00

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On January 14, 2000 at 18:04:53, Amir Ban wrote:

>On January 14, 2000 at 12:11:54, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>
>>On January 14, 2000 at 09:32:35, Enrique Irazoqui wrote:
>>
>>>On January 14, 2000 at 09:04:51, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>>
>>>>On January 14, 2000 at 06:43:27, Enrique Irazoqui wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On January 14, 2000 at 06:39:02, Alvaro Polo wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On January 14, 2000 at 06:36:05, Enrique Irazoqui wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On January 14, 2000 at 06:21:04, Alvaro Polo wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>It is my opinion that Kasparov should play Deep Blue.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>This is off track. Kasparov always wanted the rematch, but IBM dismantled Deep
>>>>>>>Blue. Hsu's new machine is not Deep Blue.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Ok, Enrique. Deep Blue does not longer exists. But what counts is perception
>>>>>>more than reality, many times.
>>>>>
>>>>>But this is precisely the point. Hsu's new machine is not perceived as IBM's
>>>>>Deep Blue by anyone except the few people in computer chess.
>>>>>
>>>>>Enrique
>>>>
>>>>I'm not sure I agree... and offer "Seymour Cray" as an example.  He left CDC
>>>>to design a new and faster machine.  He had no problems getting financial
>>>>backing as everyone _knew_ he designed the CDC 6600/Cyber 176.  He left Cray
>>>>Research to build the Cray-2/Cray-3.  Again, he had no trouble getting financial
>>>>backers.  Everyone knew it was the "man" and not the "company" that came up with
>>>>the design ideas.
>>>>
>>>>I think Hsu is exactly the same...
>>>
>>>From a programmer's point of view it may be the same, but the Kasparov-DB
>>>rematch has the whole world as an audience, and in this whole world everyone
>>>knows IBM Deep Blue as the machine that beat Kasparov, no one aside from
>>>computer chess people and academic circles know Hsu's project. How to justify to
>>>them that a new XXX "mystery box" plays the world champion? Put it this way: in
>>>this context, Kasparov has nothing to win, everything to lose and then no reason
>>>to play.
>>>
>>>Enrique
>>>
>>
>>"Kasparov knows" and that is all that counts.  He demanded a rematch many
>>times.  Then when he gets the opportunity to finally (perhaps) get his just
>>revenge, he walks away.
>>
>>That is his choice to do, of course.  But _he_ knows that Hsu was "Deep Blue".
>
>I think Kasparov would know who Hsu is, but only if you refresh his memory. I'm
>pretty sure Kasparov doesn't think of Hsu as the man who beat him, or that he
>was "Deep Blue". On the other hand I noticed he's not likely to forget C.J.Tan
>or Benjamin. It's pretty clear from his statements that he considered himself
>beaten by the full weight of IBM Corporation, and that is Deep Blue for him.
>
>Amir


You could certainly be right.  However, I can't imagine him not knowing the
man that designed the machine that turned his world upside down.  IE he
certainly knew Ken Thompson since he stayed with Ken on a couple of visits
to the NY area.  Ken knew Hsu personally since he talked with Hsu many times
as he re-designed the belle processor to fit a single chip.  I can't imagine
"Hsu" not coming up at every corner of conversations about Deep Blue...

But I suppose anything _is_ possible...



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