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Subject: Re: Let's back off for a minute from Rc6

Author: Wayne Lowrance

Date: 09:19:19 10/20/00

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On October 20, 2000 at 10:37:26, Uri Blass wrote:

>On October 20, 2000 at 09:56:24, Wayne Lowrance wrote:
>
>>On October 20, 2000 at 09:26:43, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>
>>>On October 20, 2000 at 01:00:07, Ratko V Tomic wrote:
>>>
>>>>> IE if my program plays Rc6 and I can prove it is correct, I am happy.
>>>>> If I can prove it is bad, even though it won the game, I am not happy.
>>>>> If I can't prove it either way, I am concerned.  That was the point
>>>>> here.  I want my fate in my hands, not resting on whether my
>>>>> opponent overlooks something or not.
>>>>
>>>>You are idealizing ability of risk-averse programs. If it were tic-tac-toe
>>>>you can prove move is correct. But in chess, just because some hand-put
>>>>tangle of evaluation terms gives, say, 0.3 pawns more for move A than
>>>>for other moves B, C,... you haven't proven move A is correct. It is
>>>>only "correct" within the model game (-tree) your program substitutes
>>>>for the full chess tree (where every leaf is win, draw, loss).
>>>
>>>You are making the assumption that "heuristics" cannot be "accurate".  I
>>>can give you lots of examples where this is a false assumption.  IE try to
>>>play a simple k and p vs k ending against Crafty.  With no tablebases.
>>>It only takes a few heuristics to play this perfectly, as any good endgame
>>>book whill explain.
>>
>>That is very narrow thinking, picking out simplistic examples, the big picture,
>>the whole game is another story. Bob do you think there are many perfect games
>>played by a player ? even one ?
>
>I believe that there are a lot of games.
>
>I believe that the draw in 11 moves of kasparov was a game with no mistakes.
>I believe that weaker players played draws with no mistake even in cases when
>they did not agree to a draw in the opening.
>
>There are cases when the opening leads to an endgame that is easy to play when
>the players can play a lot of moves with no mistake.
>
>Uri

What is the definition of _mistake_, I believe not finding the best move is a
mistake. And during the course of a game continually finding moves that are not
really bad but not best will cause you to loose a game. Only the best move is
correct, 2nd, 3rd best is a _mistake_. A game complete always finding the best I
believe has not really been played.
Wayne



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