Author: Robert Hyatt
Date: 19:00:50 08/09/01
Go up one level in this thread
On August 09, 2001 at 18:15:40, Bruce Moreland wrote: >On August 09, 2001 at 16:36:56, Robert Hyatt wrote: > >>On August 09, 2001 at 11:29:30, Christopher A. Morgan wrote: >> >>> >>>The following direct quotes are taken from the Braingames site, sponsor of the >>>Kramnik v. Deep Fritz match. Disinformation reigns. Disinformation is >>>information that is intended to mislead. >>> >>>?Chess champion to play 'smartest' supercomputer.? >>> >>>? ?Put it this way, the Deep Blue supercomputer that beat Kasparov in 1997 >>>weighed 1.4 tons, was over 6ft high and needed 20 people to keep it running. The >>>new Deep Fritz can run on a laptop. Even on a fast desktop machine it will be >>>able to achieve the playing level of any incarnation of Deep Blue. I?ll let you >>>draw your own conclusions as to what this is going to do to Kramnik.? Frederic >>>Friedel of ChessBase.? >> >> >>Note that this is the same guy that told Garry Kasparov how to prepare to beat >>Deep Blue in 1997. Full of good advice and factual statements as you can see. > >Do you know Frederic? Yes. I would not call him a friend, nor an enemy. Just an acquaintance. > >I don't know the full extent of the whole "Chessbase and CSS are evil" thing, >and if there is a lot of truth to it, I don't know where the evil comes from. > I don't attribute "evil" to them. Just ridiculous statements, and the perception that some of them know far more than they _really_ know. Which is really dangerous to some. As Kasparov discovered, rather painfully. >Perhaps Frederic is evil. If you talk to Frederic, you won't get that >impression. He is a very soft-spoken honest-sounding guy who seems to have a >lot of intelligence and insight. > >Okay, so let's say that Frederic, doing the best he can to support his friend >Gary, said some stupid stuff to Gary. Big deal. I have a hard time condemning >people for doing occasional stupid things, otherwise I'd have to condemn myself >next time I do something stupid, and that's going to happen in less than an >hour, I bet. Again, I don't think he is "evil" and hope I never suggested that. I would directly state the following opinions, however: (1) he gave Kasparov woefully lacking advice about playing Deep Blue. By convincing him that practicing against Fritz would be the best way to prepare, he set the stage for a total debacle. Fritz was to Deep Blue as a western-flyer red wagon is to an Indy Racer. (2) he is allowing _obviously_ misleading (and false) statements to stand on their web site. IE that this program beat Deep Blue. That it is far stronger than deep blue. That the hardware is a super-computer. Etc. Any of those statements would be met by derision and laughter at any major computing conference anywhere in the world. And I do mean _laughter_. > >>>?There is no guarantee, however, that Deep Fritz 7, designed by computer and >>>chess specialists, is indeed the strongest chess computer ever created.? >>> >>>Deep Fritz is a chess program, of course, not a ?chess computer.? There is no >>>mention whatsoever of the hardware to be used in the match and/or its comparison >>>to Deep Blue, and for good reason, there is no comparison between the two. Deep >>>Fritz is a child?s toy compared to the last Deep Blue. >>> >>>Supercomputer? Since when has a bundle of 8 PC microprocessors been considered >>>a supercomputer? That Deep Fritz can achieve ?the playing level of any >>>incarnation of Deep Blue? on a fast desktop machine is a completely false >>>statement on its face, by many magnitudes, and Friedel knows it. >> >> >>Of course it is false. an 8-way box has about as much in common with a >>super-computer as does my calculator. Both are digital, but that is where >>the simularities stop. This is basically marketing nonsense spun to justify >>the huge prize fund and attract interest. If it blows up in his face, he is >>going to look pretty silly. > >Could be. There could also be a few crazy reporters involved. I never fully >believe any quote I read in the newspaper. > >I bet they are hyping it at least a bit. The lure would be almost impossible to >resist, and it's not just they who'd do it. At least a "bit". A Cray T932 is about as close to an 8-way xeon box as that Indy Racer is close to that red wagon above. If the chessbase web-site is going to supply this kind of garbage, they ought to ask someone that has used a supercomputer to find out what in the world such a thing is. Rather than using a word they don't understand. If they stood up at (say) supercomputing and said either of the following: (a) the 8-way xeon is a supercomputer; (b) the 8-way xeon is a vagina; I would not want to predict which would produce the most laughter... :) > >Imagine what IBM would say about DB now, if they brought it back. > >If you would like Frederic's email address I'm sure I can find it. > >bruce I have his email. I get those marathon emails from him from time to time. But the hype about the 8-way DF box is simply ridiculous...
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