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Subject: Re: Commercial program strength vs. amateur program strength

Author: Uri Blass

Date: 21:57:21 12/20/01

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On December 20, 2001 at 21:14:53, Christophe Theron wrote:

>On December 20, 2001 at 19:54:48, Thomas Mayer wrote:
>
>>Hi Christophe,
>>
>>> 2) My program as well as other commercial
>>> engines are using search techniques
>>> that have never been published.
>>
>>well, I think that is the main reason why they are stronger (among others,
>>better testing, more time etc.) and will stay stronger...
>>
>>But I think new techniques could be also discovered by Amateurs - not so long
>>ago you was also Amateur - and I am totally sure that you have VERY special
>>search techniques and pruning methods - else I do not understand the depths the
>>Tigers are reaching... It's really amazing to watch... :)
>>
>>>> Perhaps some are using forward pruning techniques that are not
>>>> published anywhere.  The degree to which this affects their playing strength >> is debatable.
>>
>>>No it's not. It makes commercial programs clearly stronger.
>>
>>In my opinion, "correct" prunning is they best way to get stronger and
>>stronger... As you said - nullmove can't be everything... believe me, I am
>>searching, maybe I will find someday something... And I am totally sure all the
>>others are also searching... futility pruning for example is an idea, but I
>>don't use it myself because it don't seems to be a win for my engine... and
>>chess is complicate enough that there could be many many many ..... many more
>>ideas... prunning is always risky, but if you find a good and robust way, it is
>>overall a win... and I believe, YOU have found something and the others for sure
>>also... As long as chess programs evaluate 99,999% totally idiotic positions
>>there is a way to prune something away... The question is: HOW... :)
>
>
>
>It's not that a have a special technique. It's that I have many of small
>techniques, each adding value to the engine.
>
>There is no "big thing" to find I think. But there are many small improvements
>to find. In the end you it makes a big difference.
>
>But there is no miracle. It represents years of work.
>
>
>
>    Christophe

I think that the time is dependent in the programmer and it is possible that a
programmer with more talent can do it in a few months.

I agree that there are many things to find but I also tend to believe that there
is a big thing to find.

Uri



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