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Subject: Re: Commercial program strength vs. amateur program strength

Author: Will Singleton

Date: 22:31:46 12/20/01

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On December 21, 2001 at 00:57:21, Uri Blass wrote:

>On December 20, 2001 at 21:14:53, Christophe Theron wrote:
>
>>On December 20, 2001 at 19:54:48, Thomas Mayer wrote:
>>
>>>Hi Christophe,
>>>
>>>> 2) My program as well as other commercial
>>>> engines are using search techniques
>>>> that have never been published.
>>>
>>>well, I think that is the main reason why they are stronger (among others,
>>>better testing, more time etc.) and will stay stronger...
>>>
>>>But I think new techniques could be also discovered by Amateurs - not so long
>>>ago you was also Amateur - and I am totally sure that you have VERY special
>>>search techniques and pruning methods - else I do not understand the depths the
>>>Tigers are reaching... It's really amazing to watch... :)
>>>
>>>>> Perhaps some are using forward pruning techniques that are not
>>>>> published anywhere.  The degree to which this affects their playing strength >> is debatable.
>>>
>>>>No it's not. It makes commercial programs clearly stronger.
>>>
>>>In my opinion, "correct" prunning is they best way to get stronger and
>>>stronger... As you said - nullmove can't be everything... believe me, I am
>>>searching, maybe I will find someday something... And I am totally sure all the
>>>others are also searching... futility pruning for example is an idea, but I
>>>don't use it myself because it don't seems to be a win for my engine... and
>>>chess is complicate enough that there could be many many many ..... many more
>>>ideas... prunning is always risky, but if you find a good and robust way, it is
>>>overall a win... and I believe, YOU have found something and the others for sure
>>>also... As long as chess programs evaluate 99,999% totally idiotic positions
>>>there is a way to prune something away... The question is: HOW... :)
>>
>>
>>
>>It's not that a have a special technique. It's that I have many of small
>>techniques, each adding value to the engine.
>>
>>There is no "big thing" to find I think. But there are many small improvements
>>to find. In the end you it makes a big difference.
>>
>>But there is no miracle. It represents years of work.
>>
>>
>>
>>    Christophe
>
>I think that the time is dependent in the programmer and it is possible that a
>programmer with more talent can do it in a few months.
>
>I agree that there are many things to find but I also tend to believe that there
>is a big thing to find.
>
>Uri

The big thing to find is faster hardware.  One can freeze his current prog, and
in a few years it will beat every human on the planet.

Will



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