Author: Ricardo Gibert
Date: 14:06:17 02/13/04
Go up one level in this thread
On February 13, 2004 at 15:49:02, Uri Blass wrote: >On February 13, 2004 at 14:19:32, Steven Edwards wrote: > >>A brief comparison of the two knowledge based chess programs implemented in >>Lisp: Paradise and Symbolic: >> >>Author (Paradise) David Wilkins of Sunny California. >>Author (Symbolic) S. J. Edwards of Frozen New England. >> >>Date (Paradise) operational in 1979. >>Date (Symbolic) begun in 2003, planned completion in late 2004. >> >>Implementation language (Paradise) MacLisp from MIT >>Implementation language (Symbolic) ANSI C++ for the underlying chess toolkit >>package, ASNI C++ for the ChessLisp (by Edwards) interpreter, and ChessLisp for >>the knowledge based chess program itself. ChessLisp is a comprehensive subset >>of Common Lisp with the addition of chess specific support. >> >>Implementation hardware (Paradise) Digital pdp10 (36 bits, Multics OS) >>Implementation hardware (Symbolic) Any 32 or 64 bit platform supporting ANSI C++ >>and POSIX; currently using a mixture of Apple Macintoshes (OS X/OpenBSD), a 400 >>MHz AMD K6 (Linux), and a dual 1.13 GHz Intel P3 (Linux). >> >>Data structure primitives (Paradise) Lisp atoms and lists. >>Data structure primitives (Symbolic) Lisp atoms and lists. ChessLisp has more >>than a hundred primitive chess specific operations that access chess specific >>structure types for atoms; these types include moves, boards, bitboards, >>bitboard databases, positions, trees, and nodes. About a dozen chess specific >>enumeration types (including squares, pieces, and directions) also have built in >>support. >> >>Data structure operations (Paradise) MacLisp operations. >>Data structure operations (Symbolic) ChessLisp operations. Computationally >>expensive operations on chess structures are performed by the chess toolkit >>routines as activated by the ChessLisp implementation of chess specific >>operations like Generate, Execute, Retract, and ExpandNode. >> >>Property list usage (Paradise) The usual Lisp property list usage. >>Property list usage (Symbolic) The usual Lisp property list usage. Various >>chess specific structure types have extensive property lists initialized by >>access to the underlying toolkit. >> >>Domain (Paradise) Any chess position with emphasis on complex tactical >>middlegame positions. >>Domain (Symbolic) Any chess position; support included for an opening book and >>for tablebases. >> >>Search rate (Paradise) Highly variable, approximate mean of 20 seconds per node. >>Search rate (Symbolic) Too early to tell. Simple movepath enumeration run from >>ChessLisp is about 100,000 nodes per second on a 1 GHz PowerPC Macintosh. >>Knowledge based search will be much, much slower; the target rate is 20 (yes, >>only 20) nodes per second. > >1)I do not understand this target. > >This may be a result of implementing knowledge but the target should be >implementing knowledge and not searching less nodes per second. > >2)I know nothing about paradise. >I do not know about a single game that paradise played. > >If it was not developed to play games then what was the target of paradise? >I also guess that 20 seconds per node was in old hardware of 1980 and today it >should be clearly faster. > >Uri At the following link there is a short discussion (section 4.5 on selective search) of the Paradise program and why it possibly interests SE so much: http://citeseer.nj.nec.com/cache/papers/cs/24162/http:zSzzSzwww.cs.ualberta.cazSz~tonyzSzRecentPaperszSzreport.mac.pdf/marsland91computer.pdf If D. E. Wilkins' work interests you, here is another link that may interest you: http://www.ai.sri.com/~wilkins/
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