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Subject: Re: A Blast from the past - Feng Hsu Let's start with the Rules

Author: chandler yergin

Date: 08:40:50 04/24/05

Go up one level in this thread


On April 24, 2005 at 10:19:26, Robert Hyatt wrote:

>On April 24, 2005 at 04:29:52, chandler yergin wrote:
>
>>On April 23, 2005 at 23:52:36, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>
>>>On April 23, 2005 at 20:41:53, chandler yergin wrote:
>>>
>>>>On April 23, 2005 at 12:07:19, Rolf Tueschen wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On April 22, 2005 at 19:18:55, chandler yergin wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>       Rule Number 13 is quite revealing..
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>I never heard about the rule 13 - indeed it's an incredible thing to digest. The
>>>>>team of IBM could interfere, when it was their move, to the hardware, i.e. the
>>>>>hash-relevant parts of the machine IF they saw - with the help of friendly GM
>>>>>contact, that DBII was trying to play a nonsense move where Kasparov could have
>>>>>had certain advantages! My interpretation of that rule is that IBM was allowed
>>>>>to break DBII's thoughtprocess and then continue with a fresh attempt and
>>>>>because of time management reasons they could have forced the machine to play
>>>>>something, the machine normally would never have played. To me now the positions
>>>>>Kasparov had in mind are completely explanable. If there was a human influence
>>>>>on the machine, it was even allowed by the rules, here rule 13! Unbelievable.
>>>>>Now I don't understand why Kasparov complained at all! Because what he suspected
>>>>>was absolutely within the rules.
>>>>
>>>>Yes.. the 'time management' software divides up the thinking time for the
>>>>Computer. If the Time control is 40 moves in 2 hours 120 minutes divided
>>>>by 40 averages 3 minutes a move.
>>>>
>>>>In Game 2 Deep Blue used 6.5 minutes for it's  critical move; which is why
>>>>Kasparov suspected possible human intervention, and wanted a copy of the
>>>>Log.   Logical and justifiable in my opinion.
>>>>
>>>>Would you agree?
>>>
>>>
>>>No, because no computer uses 3 minutes per move.
>>
>>I said 'average'. You weren't playing the game, Kasparov was.
>>He thought it pondered too long, and rightfully needed an explanation.
>>
>
>There is no "rightfully needed an explanation" in chess.  Last time I looked at
>the official rules of chess, there was no limit on the time for a single move,
>nor was there any requirement to explain myself should I take longer on one move
>than on another.  Human players do this _all_ the time.

When playing against humans yes.

When a Computer deviates from the norm by a significant amount, it's reasonable
and logical to ask "why".
>
>It was crap.

Your obvious Bias is showing again.


>
>
>
>
>>
>>you do
>> They vary significantly
>>>because of pondering, failing low as happened in that game, etc.
>>>
>>>If you make poor assumptions, you reach poor conclusions...
>>
>>You do that a lot.
>
>
>
>Actually I was referring to you.  You are going on about something you don't
>have a clue about.
>
>
>
>
>>>
>>>Several of us have looked at the logs for the games, and game 2 looked perfectly
>>>normal and the program even reported a fail low and "panic time" where it
>>>searched longer than normal because of the fail low.
>>
>>Yes.. way after the fact you looked at the Logs; why were they not given to
>>Garry when he requested them?
>
>
>Sorry but several of us looked at the logs within a week of the question being
>raised.  You can find a post by Amir Ban with his interpretation...  You can
>find my response which even included a near-identical entry from a Crafty log
>from ICC play.
>
>
>
>>
>>You understand the 'panic' time, he didn't.
>
>So?  Where in the rules does it say that one player must explain his "thinking"
>to another player, including why he took more time, etc.  If you can show me
>that in any rule used for the match, or in any rule in "The official FIDE rules
>of chess" then you have a point.  Otherwise, no.  BTW he had advisors that
>understood this.  He had played Fritz many practice games.  Fritz certainly does
>it.
>
>
>
>>
>>He was under a Hell of a lot of pressure, you were not.
>
>And that has what to do with anything?
>
>
>
>
>>
>>
>>>
>>>This is a red herring and crap.
>>
>>No, you have to understand the time, place & circumstance; but your
>>overwhelming dislike and bias against Kasparov blinds you to the truth.
>
>Sorry but I was a Kasparov fan for _years_.  And am still a fan of his chess,
>but after 1997 "Kasparov the man" is a pretty poor example of humanity.



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