Author: Robert Hyatt
Date: 13:17:31 06/22/05
Go up one level in this thread
On June 21, 2005 at 23:00:37, Robin Smith wrote: >On June 21, 2005 at 18:36:34, Robert Hyatt wrote: > >>On June 21, 2005 at 16:44:21, Torstein Hall wrote: >> >>>On June 21, 2005 at 15:30:03, Robert Hyatt wrote: >>> >>>>On June 21, 2005 at 14:19:44, Robin Smith wrote: >>>> >>>>>On June 21, 2005 at 14:11:23, Mark Young wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>On June 21, 2005 at 14:04:37, Ted Summers wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>>To sum it up " He played a drawish opening in a tactic way. " Not a good idea >>>>>>>when computers are able to hang with the best and proving themself as better >>>>>>>than humans in open tactical positions. However I still think GM Adams can pull >>>>>>>it together and Win or Draw this match. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>[D] r2q1rk1/1pp3pp/p2b4/nP1p1p1b/2PPn3/3B1N1P/P1QN1PP1/1RB1R1K1 b - - 0 17 >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Having reached this position, we seemed to be watching the beginning of the end >>>>>>>for Adams in the first game but hopefully not the match. >>>>>> >>>>>>C4! was a killer positional shot. >>>>> >>>>>c4 was a good move, but hardly a "killer". >>>>> >>>>>>It seems clear GM Adams missed this move when he played Na5. >>>>> >>>>>Perhaps Adams miissed it, but it hardly seems "clear", since Black is still OK >>>>>afterwards. His loss happened later. >>>>> >>>>>-Robin >>>>The problem here is that the kingside is already a bit open. One does _not_, as >>>>a human, allow the computer to open _both_ sides of the board in the same game. >>>>It invites a debacle such as this. Of course, he made a couple of tactical >>>>errors around the point where the rook on C8 was hanging, but he was already in >>>>the wrong kind of position... >>>> >>>>All the comps were suggesting the same moves as played by Hydra, so there was no >>>>real surprises from the white side, just black making an error here, an error >>>>there, before long he fell off the rim of the canyon. >>> >>>This is in my view far to general. Black was at least = uptil move 23.Be6 >>>[D]2rq1r1k/6pp/p2bB3/2p1Np1b/3Pn3/7P/P1Q2PP1/1RB1R1K1 b - - 0 23 >> >> >>Define "equal". Here I am considering the important detail that white is a >>computer, black is a human. In that regard, black is _not_ equal up to move 23. > >By that logic Adams was already much worse after 1.e4 no matter what he did. >Let's face it, Hydra is stronger. Adams will probably be under presure in every >game where he has the black pieces. > >> In fact, I don't believe black is anywhere near equal. > >He is equal unless you use your "considering the important detail that white is >a computer" logic. > >>He isn't lost, but he is far from equal and is at best fighting for a draw. > >>But in an open position. >>And he just has no chance in that kind of position. > >He was under presure, yes. That is a far cry from "has no chance". > >>But I would take white anywhere along the way in that game, as a human playing >>another human. And by the way, any move after the "knight to the rim" move >>finds white better IMHO. > >Your opinion is wrong, unless perhaps you mean that white had a very slight >advantage. That is the norm in chess, by the way. > >>>Adams played 23...Rc7 while 23...cxd4 looks like it holds everything nicely >>>together. >> >>Doesn't quite hold everything nicely together. The comps were at about +1 here >>already, went to +1.5 on the Rc7 move. > >Maybe Craqfty sees +1, but the top programs don't see anything near +1 until >_after_ Rc7. Before Rc7 black was fine. > >>But then the next few moves were mostly >>bad by black, turning this into a debacle. But if there were not so many open >>files, open diagonals, etc, black wouldn't have had to be worrying about tactics >>all over the board. >> >> >> >>> One line could be 23...cxd4 24.Qxc8 Qf6 25.Qc4 Qxe5 26.Qa5 and black >>>looks OK to me. >> >>But white looks better to me there. Maybe not "winning better" but >>"significantly better". > >Try "very slightly better". Adams played well until Rc7. Hydra is very strong >and kept putting the presure on and finally Adams made a mistake. > >-Robin Again, let me remind you that I qualified my response to "knowing this is a computer vs human, black is exposing himself to difficulty." I'd be fairly happy with either side against an equal human opponent. But against a computer, I want things blocked, not open. e4 e5 is the wrong way to block things up. There are multiple options after e4 that avoid many of the wide-open king-pawn type positions... He's done the same thing again today. f4 was the move I would play as white, _unless_ I was playing a computer. Before I would play f4, I would have to be _certain_ that I can win from that point. I would not want to leave the computer playing on both sides of the board, with a pair of bishops, pair of rooks and a queen still on the board. So again, my comments were based not on pure chess, but on the opponent for Adams...
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