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Subject: Re: What is AI?

Author: Robert Hyatt

Date: 08:56:21 12/17/99

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On December 17, 1999 at 04:11:29, Torstein Hall wrote:

>
>I have always belived intelligence in humans had to do with the ability to adapt
>to new cirumstanses ( how do you spell that? ) in a fast and efficent way. For
>instanse you could change the rules in chess a little bit, and the one adapting
>with success to the new rules would be the most intelligent under the
>circumstances.
>Under such a definition of intelligence, I can not see why we should call
>computer chess AI. ( Try to change the rules and check how well the Crafty and
>Fritzes of this world are doing.... :-) ).


Depends on how you change the rules.  IE crafty doesn quite well at all sorts
of wild games, fischer-random (without castling) and so forth.  I have been
asked by a GM (you wouldn't believe who if I told you so I won't just yet) to
implement Fischer-random for him with castling working, and it isn't very hard
to do, just a little kludge for castling generation which isn't used after
castling happens anyway.

If you mean things like 10x10 chess with a new piece, then computers will have
great trouble without a lot of programming.  However, I know a _lot_ of people
that don't change very easily either.  :)  Either they aren't intelligent, or
computers are to an extent.  :)




>Intelligence should be intelligense even if its artificial!
>
>Torstein
>
>
>
>
>On December 16, 1999 at 23:19:42, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>
>>On December 16, 1999 at 21:17:46, Dann Corbit wrote:
>>
>>>A similar thread brings up an interesting question, "What is AI?"
>>>
>>>An old test was supposed to be that if we are playing a remote opponent we can't
>>>tell if it is a human or a machine.  I think that can probably be achieved now
>>>(especially if we throw in a bit of randomness).
>>
>>Actually a computer probably can't pass at chess.  Computers find mates way
>>too quickly.  They make stupid mistakes in known 'trap' positions.  Yes you
>>could kludge a fix for the mates too quickly, but it is not hard to catch
>>a computer with that kind of analysis...  unfortunately.  I doubt that is
>>what Turing had in mind, of course.  But this was a discussion I had in 1984
>>with a non-computer-scientist.  And he uncovered Cray Blitz just this way.  :)
>>
>>
>>>
>>>Then what tends to happen is that we say, "That's not really artificial
>>>intelligence.  After all, it's just a machine, so it _can't_ be."  We simply
>>>move the target and we are safe from the encroachment of the machine into "our"
>>>domain.
>>>
>>
>>
>>AI has two common definitions:
>>
>>(1) doing something that requires intelligence by a human to do.  IE play
>>the game of chess.  But as soon as someone sees how easy this is to do,
>>this gets changed to:
>>
>>(2) doing something that requires intelligence by a human to do.  And it has
>>to be done in a way that is very similar to the way the human does it.  IE in
>>chess, if a human considers 100 positions to choose a move, then the program has
>>to do approximately the same.  (2) is often used when it becomes obvious that
>>(1) was much easier than anyone once thought.  :)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>If (for instance) I was playing some opponent using Winboard and I only knew it
>>>was one of:
>>>"Kasparov"
>>>"Deep Blue"
>>>
>>>I would have no way of guessing which was which, since either one would pound my
>>>stuffings out effortlessly.
>>
>>
>>Yes you would.  Give them both a mate in 15 position.  DB will find it way
>>quicker.  :)
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>
>>>So the question stands, "What is AI?" and along with it, the related question,
>>>"Are chess programs intelligent?"
>>
>>
>>Depends on which side of the fence you sit on. :)



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