Author: David Dory
Date: 05:07:22 04/14/02
Go up one level in this thread
On April 13, 2002 at 05:11:15, Sune Fischer wrote:
>On April 13, 2002 at 02:21:38, David Dory wrote:
>
>>On April 13, 2002 at 00:37:45, Joe McCarro wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>>Hsu and team had ALREADY MADE A WORLD CHAMP - DEEP THOUGHT. Then they re-did it
>>>>with TWO more revisions, DB and Deeper Blue. Increasing it's hardware, which as
>>>>has been mentioned, is the biggest factor in chess computer improvement in the
>>>>past 20 years. (Try running Fritz on a real clunker CPU/system for a hoot!)
>>>
>>>Hardware:
>>>Wasn't it borne out that the software that had very knowledgable selective
>>>search made much greater gains with better hardware than the software that
>>>wasn't as "knowledgable". In other words, the programs with more of a brute
>>>force approach experienced diminishing returns with faster hardware whereas
>>>computers with allot of knowledge really took off with better hardware. From
>>>what I understand Fritz 7 has alot more knowledge built in unlike its earlier
>>>versions. Nobody really seems to know what knowledge was added to Deeper blue.
>>>Maybe it had dimishing returns maybe not.
>>
>>Nope.
>>
>>All programs experience diminishing returns with greater depth. The programmers
>>work harder and harder for a smaller increase in playing strength. Nevertheless,
>>it is hardware not software, that has provided the largest increase in chess
>>program strength in the last 20 years.
>
>That is a myth.
>You only have to take one look at the SSDF list to see there are significant
>improvements from version to version on the same hardware.
>
My point, which is not a myth, is that the improvement from better hardware has
certainly _exceeded_ the improvement from software in chess playing strength.
My first chess playing computer ran on a Z80 at 4MHz, (an 8 bit CPU). Consider
the gain made by taking that same program (the Spracklen's Fidelity program) and
moving it (not changing it except to re-compile it for the better processor), it
to an Intel P4 at 2GHZ at 32 bits.
Let's do a rough arithmetic: 8 bit to 32 bit, = 4 X improvement
+ 2000 Mhz/4Mhz = 500 X improvement
=========================================
Sub Total = 2,000 X improvement
And that's just the main CPU. Then we have the faster memories (and lots more of
them. My first PC had 512K of memory, and a 20MB Hard Drive, now I've got a Gig
of memory and a 100GB HD (great for all those TB files). And of course the disk
access times have shrunk from about 22ms to about 7ms, so:
Memory improvement = 1000Megs/0.5Megs = 2,000 X improvement
Hard Disk improvement (size) = 100,000MB/20MB = 5,000 X improvement
Hard Disk speed improvement = 22ms/7ms = 3 X improvment
=========================================
Sub Total = 20,000,000 X improvement
So HOW MUCH OF AN IMPROVEMENT IS THAT, SUNE? My calculator won't go that high!
If you want to talk percent improvment for the hardware, be sure to add two
zeroes onto the end. :-)
Naturally, no program will use all these hardware improvements 100%, but I think
anyone with a little sense can see that HARDWARE has made the largest
improvements to chess playing strength, NOT SOFTWARE.
Indeed, many features of the top programs wouldn't even be practical at all on
original PC hardware, let along the woeful hardware of a BORIS or CHESS
CHALLENGER.
Dave
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