Author: odell hall
Date: 20:41:08 07/12/01
Go up one level in this thread
On July 12, 2001 at 23:26:21, Dann Corbit wrote: >On July 12, 2001 at 22:33:51, odell hall wrote: > >>Who says computers have the positional understanding of a 2100??? In the game >>Junior 7 finds the Novelty played by Anand 11...Be7!! at about 1 min at depth >>15 on my Thunderbird 1000, previous moves which has been played in this position >>are 11...nf6, bb7, h6. I tested a few other programs, (fritz, gambit tiger) >>they were unable to find the move. I am not 100% sure it is the best, but if >>Anand plays it, there has to definitely be something to it. Listening to the >>commentary I notice no one expected this move. How stupid can computers be to >>find a purely positional move that annand plays??? >> >> >>Morozevich,A - Anand,V >[D]r1b1k2r/2qp1ppp/p3pn2/1p2n3/1b1BP3/1NN2P2/PPPQ2PP/2KR1B1R b kq - 0 1 >> >>Analysis by Junior 7: >> >>11...h5 12.Qg5 >> ² (0.36) Depth: 3 00:00:00 >>11...Nc6 12.Bxf6 gxf6 13.Qh6 Bxc3 >> = (0.21) Depth: 6 00:00:00 3kN >>11...Nc6 12.Bxf6 gxf6 13.Qh6 Bxc3 >> = (0.21) Depth: 6 00:00:00 3kN >>11...Nc6 12.Bxf6 gxf6 13.Qh6 Bxc3 >> = (0.21) Depth: 6 00:00:00 3kN >>11...Nc6 12.Bxf6 gxf6 13.Qh6 Bxc3 14.bxc3 Bb7 >> ± (0.74) Depth: 9 00:00:00 56kN >>11...h6 12.a3 Be7 13.f4 Nc4 14.Qf2 Bb7 >> = (0.17) Depth: 9 00:00:00 88kN >>11...h6 12.a3 Bd6 13.Be3 Be7 14.Bf4 b4 15.axb4 Bxb4 16.Be2 >> = (0.16) Depth: 12 00:00:01 698kN >>11...0-0 12.a3 Bd6 13.Be3 Be7 14.Bf4 b4 15.axb4 Bxb4 16.Be2 Bxc3 >> = (0.08) Depth: 12 00:00:04 2991kN >>11...0-0 12.a3 Bd6 13.Bxb5 Bb7 14.Bf2 Bxa3 15.bxa3 Rfc8 16.Bc5 axb5 17.Nxb5 Qb8 >> ² (0.39) Depth: 15 00:00:17 12443kN >>11...h6 12.a3 Bd6 13.Bb6 Qxb6 14.Qxd6 Qxd6 15.Rxd6 Ke7 16.Rd1 Nc6 17.Be2 >> = (0.16) Depth: 15 00:00:24 17059kN >>11...Be7 12.Qf2 b4 13.Na4 d6 14.Nb6 Rb8 15.Nxc8 Qxc8 16.Be3 d5 >> = (0.02) Depth: 15 00:01:05 46644kN > >Look at the score, it is 0.02. Not exactly a ringing endorsement... > >>(hall, denver 12.07.2001) > >Here's crafty's take: >EPD Kit revision date: 1996.04.21 >unable to open book file [e:\crafty\release/books.bin]. >hash table memory = 192M bytes. >pawn hash table memory = 80M bytes. >EGTB cache memory = 32M bytes. >draw score set to 0.00 pawns. >choose from book moves randomly (using weights.) >choose from 5 best moves. >book learning enabled >result learning enabled >position learning enabled >threshold set to 9 pawns. >5 piece tablebase files found >19045kb of RAM used for TB indices and decompression tables > >Crafty v18.10 > >White(1): st 999 >search time set to 999.00. >White(1): setboard r1b1k2r/2qp1ppp/p3pn2/1p2n3/1b1BP3/1NN2P2/PPPQ2PP/2KR1B1R b >kq - 0 1 >Black(1): > puzzling over a move to ponder. > clearing hash tables > nss depth time score variation (1) >Black(1): O-O [pondering] > clearing hash tables > time surplus 0.00 time limit 16:39 (16:39) > nss depth time score variation (1) >go >Black(1): go > clearing hash tables > time surplus 0.00 time limit 16:39 (16:39) > nss depth time score variation (1) > 6-> 0.37 0.61 1. ... O-O 2. a3 Be7 3. Qg5 Nc4 4. > Kb1 > 7 0.59 0.62 1. ... O-O 2. Qg5 d6 3. a3 h6 4. Qe3 > Bxc3 5. Qxc3 > 7-> 0.92 0.62 1. ... O-O 2. Qg5 d6 3. a3 h6 4. Qe3 > Bxc3 5. Qxc3 > 8 1.41 0.63 1. ... O-O 2. Qg5 Bd6 3. Kb1 b4 4. > Na4 Bb7 5. Nac5 > 8-> 2.50 0.63 1. ... O-O 2. Qg5 Bd6 3. Kb1 b4 4. > Na4 Bb7 5. Nac5 > 9 3.49 0.66 1. ... O-O 2. Qg5 Bd6 3. Kb1 h6 4. > Qe3 Bb7 5. f4 Nfg4 > 9-> 5.42 0.66 1. ... O-O 2. Qg5 Bd6 3. Kb1 h6 4. > Qe3 Bb7 5. f4 Nfg4 > 10 9.56 0.71 1. ... O-O 2. Qg5 d6 3. a3 Bxc3 4. > Bxc3 h6 5. Qf4 Bb7 6. Ba5 Qc6 > 10 44.82 0.67 1. ... Ng6 2. Qe3 O-O 3. e5 Nh5 4. > a3 Be7 5. Qe4 Bg5+ 6. Kb1 Bb7 > 10-> 50.94 0.67 1. ... Ng6 2. Qe3 O-O 3. e5 Nh5 4. > a3 Be7 5. Qe4 Bg5+ 6. Kb1 Bb7 > 11 1:10 0.81 1. ... Ng6 2. Qe3 Bb7 3. a3 Bd6 4. > g3 Be5 5. Bxe5 Nxe5 6. f4 Nc4 7. Qd4 > 11 2:01 0.73 1. ... Be7 2. Qf2 Ng6 3. Bb6 Qe5 4. > g3 b4 5. Bd4 Qb8 6. Na4 Qc7 > 11 2:11 0.67 1. ... O-O 2. Qg5 Bd6 3. Kb1 b4 4. > Na4 h6 5. Qe3 Re8 6. f4 Nfg4 > 11-> 2:21 0.67 1. ... O-O 2. Qg5 Bd6 3. Kb1 b4 4. > Na4 h6 5. Qe3 Re8 6. f4 Nfg4 > 12 2:42 0.71 1. ... O-O 2. Qg5 Bd6 3. Kb1 h6 4. > Qe3 Nc4 5. Qf2 e5 6. Bxc4 exd4 7. Bd5 > 12 4:31 0.66 1. ... Be7 2. f4 Nc4 3. Bxc4 bxc4 4. > Na1 O-O 5. Be5 Qc5 6. Bd6 Bxd6 7. Qxd6 > Qe3+ 8. Qd2 Ng4 > 12-> 5:49 0.66 1. ... Be7 2. f4 Nc4 3. Bxc4 bxc4 4. > Na1 O-O 5. Be5 Qc5 6. Bd6 Bxd6 7. Qxd6 > Qe3+ 8. Qd2 Ng4 > 13 6:00 1/45* 1. ... Be7 > >Do the scores or trajectories show that either of these programs has GM >positional understanding? Actually the score for Junior 7 is pretty good, considering that Black's goal in the opening is to equalize, to achieve this at only move 11.. is not bad, obviously junior thinks be7 is the only equalizing move. I would be interested to know why it chooses this particular move, i guess only amir can speak to this fact however, or maybe we can ask Anand!! it obviously a very deep positional ideal.
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