Author: Christopher Conkie
Date: 03:51:48 11/05/05
Go up one level in this thread
On November 05, 2005 at 02:15:56, Kurt Utzinger wrote:
>On November 04, 2005 at 18:26:55, Christopher Conkie wrote:
>
>>On November 04, 2005 at 12:43:09, Jouni Uski wrote:
>>
>>>[D]r1b1k1nr/ppp2ppp/n7/3pp3/N3q3/PK6/1PPP2PP/R1BQ1BNR b kq - bm Qxa4+ = draw
>>>
>>>Maybe incorrect (Hampe - Meitner 1872)?
>>>
>>>Jouni
>>
>>{C25 Vienna: Hammpe-Meitner}1.e4 e5 2.Nc3 Bc5 3.Na4
>>
>>I think you mean this game from 1870 and is a Vienna played in Vienna.
>>
>>1.e4 e5 2.Nc3 Bc5 3.Na4 Bxf2+ 4.Kxf2 Qh4+ 5.Ke3 Qf4+ 6.Kd3 d5 7.Kc3 Qxe4 8.Kb3
>>Na6 9.a3 Qxa4+ 10.Kxa4 Nc5+ 11.Kb4 a5+ 12.Kxc5 Ne7 13.Bb5+ Kd8 14.Bc6 b6+ 15.Kb5
>>Nxc6 16.Kxc6 Bb7+ 17.Kb5 Ba6+ 1/2-1/2
>>
>>It is a very interesting game. Engines can't cope with this. I think that both
>>Kb4 and Kb5 are draws as amazing as it seems.
>>
>>Very nice.
>>
>>Christopher
>
> Why not a readable PGN that can - including
> the header - directly imported in a chess
> program? BTW: An interesting game. I am goin
> to have a deeper look in order to find out
> if the queen sac was correct. And below the
> "readable" PGN
> Kurt
>
>[Event "Vienna"]
>[Site "Vienna"]
>[Date "1872.??.??"]
>[Round "?"]
>[White "Hampe"]
>[Black "Meitner, P."]
>[Result "1/2-1/2"]
>[ECO "C25"]
>[PlyCount "34"]
>[EventDate "1872.??.??"]
>
>1. e4 e5 2. Nc3 Bc5 3. Na4 Bxf2+ 4. Kxf2 Qh4+ 5. Ke3 Qf4+ 6. Kd3 d5 7. Kc3 Qxe4
>8. Kb3 Na6 9. a3 Qxa4+ 10. Kxa4 Nc5+ 11. Kb4 a5+ 12. Kxc5 Ne7 13. Bb5+ Kd8 14.
>Bc6 b6+ 15. Kb5 Nxc6 16. Kxc6 Bb7+ 17. Kb5 Ba6+ 1/2-1/2
Hello Kurt,
Yes....not intended to put just the game with no header. You have done it now so
thanks.
As for the position/game, this is from "The Complete Vienna" by Mikhail Tseitlin
and Igor Glazkov (Batsford/Herny Holt) 1995......
"After 3.Na4?!, Black's best is 3.....Be7! =; instead in Hamppe-Meitner, Black
sacrificed his Bishop 3.....Bxf2+ 4. Kxf2 Qh4+ 5. Ke3 Qf4+ 6. Kd3 d5 and now, by
continuing 7 Qe1! de+ 8. Kc3 e3 9. Kb3 Be6+ 10. Ka3 White could have repulsed
the attack and kept the piece."
What is not so clear is wether 11. Kb5 is a draw in the actual game, 11. Kb4 is.
Here is the complete game for playback with analysis by Andrew Soltis.
http://www.thechessdrum.net/palview/Hamppe-Meitner.htm
Also there is this...........
============================================================
A Romantic Draw
by J.D. Brattin
(From p. 13 of Michigan Chess, August/September 1973)
Hamppe was a nineteenth-century chess master with an interesting philosophy: he
liked to expose his king to the maximum possible attack as early as possible in
the hopes that his opponent would become overextended. This style of play must
have been highly infuriating to those whose attacks would fail by a hair. It
also kept Hamppe from achieving first-rate status.
Here’s an example of the Hamppe style, played against Meitner in 1874. I think
that Meitner must have eaten firecrackers for breakfast before this game.
Hamppe-Meitner
Vienna 1872
1.e4 e5 2.Nc3 Bc5 3.Na4 Bxf2+ [And here we go.] 4.Kxf2 Qh4+ 5.Ke3 [The only way
to answer the threat of 5...Qxe4+, which would win the knight on a4 and leave
Black two pawns ahead.] 5...Qf4+ 6.Kd3 [More of the same.] 6...d5 7.Kc3 [Any
other move? Try it—you won’t like it.] 7...Qxe4 8.Kb3 [Hamppe is happy—he has a
piece for two pawns and is not in any immediate danger (?).] 8...Na6 [Try a
one-move mate threat.] 9.a3 Qxa4+ [White will not be given a chance to play Nc3
and Ka2.] 10.Kxa4 Nc5+ 11.Kb4 a5+ 12.Kxc5 [If the king is going to die, he’ll
take the whole Black army down with him....] 12...Ne7 [What a time for a
developing move! White now has a chance to make his fifth non-king move—but he
must defend against the threat of 13...b6+ and 14...Bd7#. There’s only one way.]
13.Bb5+ Kd8 14.Bc6 [And now if 14...bxc6, White can play 15.a4! and 16.d3! and
there’s no way he can be checked, let alone mated.] 14...b6+ 15.Kb5 Nxc6 [The
threat is 16...Nd4+ and 17...b5#, or 17...Bd7#. 16.Ka4 is no answer: 16...Nd4.
And moves to prevent ...Nd4, such as 16.Nf3 or 16.c3, simply allow the
transposition 16...Bd7 followed by 17...Nd4#.] 16.Kxc6 [And now what does Black
have left?] 16...Bb7+ [One more sacrifice (!), and, for a change, one which
cannot be accepted. 17.Kxb7 allows 17...Kd7! And White cannot prevent
18...Rhb8#! He can only delay it for two moves, and that will cost him a queen.]
17.Kb5 Ba6+ 18.Kc6 [And now 18.Ka4 is crunched by 18...Bc4 when White cannot
prevent 19...b5#.] 18...Bb7+ [1/2; Draw! by total and utter perpetual check!]
There probably ought to be a moral to this game. I rather hope that there is
not. The final position looks like something from double-speed chess. “Partner,
give me a pawn, or anything, and it’s mate.”
Let’s put it this way. If you can move your king twelve times in the first
eighteen moves of a game, you should have a draw. But don’t try it. Odds are you
won’t last eighteen moves.
===============================================
But no mention of 11.Kb5, or even here......
http://www.herderschach.de/Training/Online/tr4p7.htm
But if you understand Dutch (someone out there does....right? :) )
http://www.xs4all.nl/~timkr/admag/remise.htm
11. Kb5 is the critical move. Now all one needs to do is translate this......
:))) Don't look at me......
Christopher
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