Author: Robert Hyatt
Date: 10:57:19 11/30/03
Go up one level in this thread
On November 30, 2003 at 13:22:20, Dieter Buerssner wrote: >On November 30, 2003 at 12:49:21, Robert Hyatt wrote: > >>On November 30, 2003 at 11:43:45, Bob Durrett wrote: >>>How do the open-source engines, like Crafty, deal with this issue? >> >>_correctly_. >> >>:) > >Are you sure? > >Crafty 17.14 with the critical position set up: > >Black(37): go > time surplus 1:12 time limit 31.29 (3:07) > nss depth time score variation (1) > 14-> 0.17 0.00 37. ... Kh7 > 15 0.17 0.00 37. ... Kh7 > 15-> 0.41 0.00 37. ... Kh7 > 16 0.41 0.00 37. ... Kh7 > 16-> 0.74 0.00 37. ... Kh7 > 17 0.74 0.00 37. ... Kh7 > 17-> 1.39 0.00 37. ... Kh7 > 18 1.39 0.00 37. ... Kh7 > 18-> 2.75 0.00 37. ... Kh7 > 19 2.75 0.00 37. ... Kh7 > 19-> 5.68 0.00 37. ... Kh7 > 20 5.68 0.00 37. ... Kh7 > 20-> 11.87 0.00 37. ... Kh7 > 21 11.87 0.00 37. ... Kh7 > 21-> 30.95 0.00 37. ... Kh7 > 22 30.95 0.00 37. ... Kh7 > time=1:02 cpu=99% mat=1 n=67680116 fh=90% nps=1077022 > ext-> checks=5044426 recaps=120656 pawns=243230 1rep=318232 thrt:4 >5078 > predicted=0 nodes=67680116 evals=13317768 > endgame tablebase-> probes done=4154 successful=460 > hashing-> trans/ref=33% pawn=99% used=99% > >Black(37): Kh7 > time used: 1:02 >game is a draw by repetition. > >Note, we first see the move, and then the info: "game drawn", which can easily >be interpreted as not correct. No it can't. Because to play a game of chess, you are required to _move_ the pieces, and _press_ the clock. That is why humans have "blind rules" for a player that can't see. And the rules explain this very clearly. If the draw is a repetition before the move is played, > >Now the same in xboard mode. It may also show a small bug in Crafty. I had set >up the position after white's 33rd move by fen and forced the moves in the >actual game, just before the critical move. Crafty ignored the movenumber of the >FEN, so I set mn to 37. > >White(38): undo >ERROR! move is illegal >NOTICE: 55 moves to next time control > >So I set back the mn, then: > >White(6): mn 6 >move number set to 6 >White(6): undo >NOTICE: 56 moves to next time control >Black(5): mn 37 >move number set to 37 >Black(37): xboard > >tellics set 1 Crafty v17.14 >kibitz Hello from Crafty v17.14! >go >move g8h7 >1/2-1/2 {Drawn by 3-fold repetition} > >Again, first the move (which would be shown on the GUI board). Then claiming the >result. Arguably also not correct, and even bad timing could come in. Assume, >xboard just sent the move to ICC. Opponent moves immediatly (say before ICC sees >the draw claim, due to some lag) and with his move, he will not allow another >repetition. > >There is no good solution in general for WB/XB. For a manually operated game, >perhaps something like > >telluser I write Kh7 on my score sheet now, and claim a draw by this. Please >call the TD, stop the clocks, don't do the move on the board ... > >would be sufficient. > >I think, GCP is quite right, when he says that probably no engine does this >correctly. Only if you use the context of playing chess. Since no computer has "hands" they certainly have a problem... > >Regards, >Dieter
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