Author: Robert Hyatt
Date: 14:14:28 11/23/98
Go up one level in this thread
On November 23, 1998 at 11:50:01, Amir Ban wrote: >On November 23, 1998 at 09:37:25, Robert Hyatt wrote: > >>On November 22, 1998 at 11:49:54, blass uri wrote: >> >>> >>>I did not ask for all the tree but only the tree up to the point that my >>>programs can see by search of 3 minutes that black has at least 1 pawn >>>advantage. >>> >>>This is clearly less positions >>>because if in the leaves it is -2.xx then Junior can see some moves before the >>>leaves that it is -1.xx >> >> >>ok... rather than 10 million pages, it might only be 1 million pages. How >>would we get those to you? :) >> > >I wonder how many people reading the last few posts of this thread have been >reminded of the story of the King's New Clothes. > > >>what you are overlooking is the point that junior (and all the other programs) >>look at a fat, shallow tree. > >I am quite sure that the opposite is true. All PC programs have a much smaller >effective branching factor than DT/DB. This is because they all do forward >pruning, many of them aggressively, while DT/DB did none, and they do >extensions, most at least as much as DT/DB, and at least in Junior, much more >aggressively than DT/DB. > > I'm going to try to keep this simple. Here is a point-blank question: if you really believe that nonsensical statement you wrote above, then how can you reconcile that with a program that is searching at least 1,000 times faster than you, yet only gets to depth 10-11 in the game? If they are not extending far more than you could ever hope to then exactly *what* are they doing with that factor of 1,000? And remember that they have a pretty simple quiescence search and they toss out bummer captures as well, so the work is *not* in looking at zillions of captures. now, in light of that, if you believe that "you extend much more aggressively than they do" then *where* are those nodes of theirs *going*??? You have a printout to look at. Ought to be able to answer that somehow... And then we will return to the definition of "hyperbole"...
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