Author: Robert Hyatt
Date: 21:32:18 05/16/04
Go up one level in this thread
On May 15, 2004 at 03:15:20, Amir Ban wrote: >On May 14, 2004 at 20:03:35, Matthew Hull wrote: > >>On May 14, 2004 at 18:26:54, Amir Ban wrote: >> >>>On May 14, 2004 at 12:32:26, Matthew Hull wrote: >>> >>>>On May 14, 2004 at 12:16:57, Gian-Carlo Pascutto wrote: >>>> >>>>>On May 13, 2004 at 20:17:42, Russell Reagan wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>Not anyone can play. Only people who have several thousand dollars and two >>>>weeks >>to burn can play. I don't know many people in that situation, or at >>>>least if >>they are in that situation and participated, the locks would be >>>>changed when >>they returned home from the trip :) >>>>> >>>>>FYI, travel costs and hardware are sponsored by the organisation. >>>> >>>>No, they are not. $2000 dollars is not sponsored by the organization, neither >>>>the hotel, nor the paid time off for two weeks. The entire situation is >>>>calculated to discourage American participation. The physical format is >>>>calculated to permit cheating, as was done with the illeagal throwing of a >>>>drawn game to the eventual "winner". It is a corrupt establishment designed to >>>>cater to European interests, and to snub Americans. >>>>It is therefore an irrelevant contest, just like the FIDE World Championship is >>>>completely irrelevant. >>>>:) >>>> >>>>CCT is now the venue for true WORLD comptetition, instead of just European >>>>competition. >>>> >>> >>>No it's not. I will come to CCT to experiment, if I come at all. Others don't >>>bother to show up, and why should they ? >> >> >>Right, what commercial product wants to get beat by crafty? It's bad for >>marketing to loose to the likes of Zappa and bodo. Then people like Vincent and >>GCP couldn't show up here slamming the professor. >> > >Make up your mind: Is crafty the menace that keeps everyone important from CCT >or is CCT the all-inclusive tournament ? > >I don't understand why I should be scared of meeting crafty at CCT, but not >scared of meeting it at WCCC. Crafty's been there in previous WCCC most of the >time. I remember 1996/1997. And maybe one other event. That's 3 out of 10 maybe... I don't believe the "scared" stuff. I'm not "scared" to play anybody. Heck, I played Deep Thought, Belle, chess 4.x... That was part of the process. I doubt any commercial programmer would be "scared". "worried" might well apply as there are serious hardware platforms that can serve like the old Colt .45 revolver of the wild-wild west. Often called "the great equalizer". :) I don't attend for simple reasons. 1. Too expensive to travel to Europe every year. If it were in NA every other year as the charter once demanded, I could at least make those as I always did in the past, and occasionally make the ones in Europe. 2. Too long. For the first 25 years these events were 5 rounds and 4 days long. Now they stretch to two weeks. My only choice would be to make that a family vacation, and it would have to be scheduled during two breaks that might possibly be long enough for me to attend. But I don't see the ICCA (or anyone) trying to work around one participant's schedule, it doesn't make much sense. It would be easier to just shorten the event. Worst case could be 5 days, 2 rounds per day, although that still turns into a week with travel days required for international travel. 3. Getting a local operator is a non-optimal solution. I can't do any book updates. Seems like the ICCA is not very big on having local network access to make that doable. The _right_ person to operate Crafty is me. I know the program. I know what kind of book lines it will do ok in and what to avoid. Due to _lots_ of experience. I can't give that experience to an operator although the three I have used did pretty well. For now, my option is the CCT events. I can attend them. They don't cost a fortune, and they are getting bigger and bigger. A couple of years will see more commercial interest as the word will slowly "get around" and customers will be asking "how did your product do in the cct-8 event?" for example. Once CCT becomes better-known, avoiding it will become a marketing mistake. That time will come. > > >>:) >> >> >> >>>It's not a major event. >> >> >>Nonesense. 50 programs is a huge event. Much bigger than some expensive, >>exclusive, back-yard barbecue at the ICGA. >> > >There are thousands of players at Biel, only a dozen at Wijk an Zee. So what ? >When was the last time Kasparov, Polgar, Anand played in Biel ? > CCT is hardly like Biel. WCCC is hardly like Wijk an Zee, either. Although it is giving it a run size-wise. :) You are _totally_ overlooking the _point_ of having WCCC events. They were originally done to _promote_ computer chess interest and development around the world. IE like the olympics. Not like professional football which is all about winning and money... which does better as far as _promoting_ chess? Biel or Wijk? > >>No. If they thought they could win, they would show up. Remember? ;) >> >>Americans don't show up in Europe because it's expensive. Commercial European >>projects don't show up at the FREE, no-expense CCT because they are chicken. >> >> >>> >>>CCT is a bit like Biel: crowded and noisy, with a few good players. But don't >>>mistake Biel for Wijk an Zee. >> >>Programs don't care how much noise there is. Just come and play. You can't >>stand it if bodo competes with you? I thought the Championship was open to all? >> Oh, only those who are well-off to afford $2000 travel. >> > >America is not a third-world country, and the problem with your argument is that >it works even better for real third-world countries, i.e. that Tanzanian program >would be the world's best, if only its author could afford to write it. I can only speak for myself, based on experience. You are confusing commercial computer chess development with amateur development. You might consider it a marketing plus to attend and hopefully do well, and consider it an investment in advertising. Not to me. It is just a cost I'll never recoup. And beginners see a cost they can neither recoup nor afford... > > >>How inclusive. >> >>:) >> >>> >>>Which reminds me that no major chess tournament takes place in the USA nowadays. >>>All the major tournaments are in Europe, but I don't hear you saying that >>>Kaidanov and Stripunsky are the world's best. >> >> >>Many Nations have easy access to Europe. America is not easy or cheap for >>Europeans to access. It's simple economics. >> > >"Easy access" ? Is this a geographical fact I didn't know ? > >Anyway, this must be the reason your major universities Harvard, Stanford, Yale >etc. are intellectual backwaters without foreign students, who all go to >European universities. Not. Apples and oranges. You go to quality when you are investing. And an education is definitely an investment. Amateur computer chess development is _not_ an investment in any way other than an investment in enjoyment... Unversities are built of people and facilities, over time. People that want a particular program or a particular faculty or a particular reputation will go to where they can find what they want. Computer chess events are not the same. They _can_ be spread around the world since they have no fixed facility or location or personnel... > >Amir > > >> >> >>> >>>Amir
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